Clue #46 - Persephone (14) +1, Hole 3, Save Me
Thanks to our faithful chatters in our comments (I think they actually beat the Speaker on this one...talk about setting world speed records for subverting authority!), we noticed that Persephone's numbers (at persephone.thehansofoundation.org ) have changed to read "+1". Speculation led us to hole3.thehansofoundation.org and we see a broken link to a photo with the file name: t9agen75.gif
A guy named Matt spied the picture before they took it away (Way to go Matt!). Below is what he gave us.
Next, someone named Duality "randomized the pallet" and zoomed in on the left eye and it looks like our picture contains the message "Save Me". This is very interesting because last week, someone named Kyle converted the Hole2 picture to audio and sent us a NEW LINK to videos with unusual sounds. We thought he was crazy when he told us he thought it said "Save Me"...now he's got us wondering if he's onto something.
Have a look and a listen and decide for yourself...
A guy named Matt spied the picture before they took it away (Way to go Matt!). Below is what he gave us.
Next, someone named Duality "randomized the pallet" and zoomed in on the left eye and it looks like our picture contains the message "Save Me". This is very interesting because last week, someone named Kyle converted the Hole2 picture to audio and sent us a NEW LINK to videos with unusual sounds. We thought he was crazy when he told us he thought it said "Save Me"...now he's got us wondering if he's onto something.
Have a look and a listen and decide for yourself...
71 Comments:
///moving the conversation over, from the critical point///
Matt the Pale said...
Guys for some reason the picture went down, but I saved a copy on my file space. You can view it here:
http://members.aol.com/mattthepale/t9agen75.gif
5/31/2006 03:06:20 PM
Matt the Pale said...
Er... I'm talking about the picture at hole3.thehansofoundation.org, of course.
5/31/2006 03:07:09 PM
antecedent said...
Very interesting...Yet another faceless man, just in a different way...hmmm
5/31/2006 03:08:07 PM
wizardry_eas said...
I wonder if the filename of the faceless man is related to the new filename
old then new filenames
q9als2002
t9agen75
5/31/2006 03:08:34 PM
Kyle said...
Well, if matt the pale can be taken at his word, then why would the image have gone red-x?
Crashed?
Prematurely posted?
Wrong image file?
Taken down for other reasons?
Intentionally brief?
Matt here is the only one who has claimed to have seen the image.
5/31/2006 03:09:33 PM
Sid said...
Has anyone tried combining all the pictures of the faceless men i.e. hole2, hole3 to see if we get something?
5/31/2006 03:09:54 PM
I know this most likely is NOT it, but funny...I see a swan in that new pic!! LOL
Don't you think it looks like 'Henry Gale' of the Others?????
Peace & Namaste
I have tried copying the older image over the new image by firstly making the white background of the older image transparent but nothing looked any good. I don't think its anything to do with that.
You're off the hook, Matt. Looks like this is the real deal.
I suspect the .avi files are getting pounded right now too. I'll wait till later.
ps it wasn't me that sent them the audio files.
Copenhagen 75?
Slightly off topic now we have new clue but if you multiply the answers you are to put in the map section 10.5 x 42000 x 2.55 and then TAN you get the answer 0. I feel there is probably a code or clue in there somewhere.
Although Speaker said that if the image isn' there it is because of the server being busy I agree with jd. It is genuinely as if it isn't there anymore. If you right click the red cross where the image should be and choose show picture it doesn't try very hard. If the server was busy it would time out then come up with that cross. As far as I know anyway.
I agree save me is what I got when I manipulated the colors as well.
matt...HOW DID you do that?
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
Props to everyone in this "think tank"...you guys make this game so fun.
FYI: Just a reminder to reload the blog in your browser every so often. When new clues come out, we are constantly editing and updating the latest post based on what you say, emails we get, and other stuff we find.
this may be me just staring at to hard but i think i the save me written in to places
the first one, the one were all seeing under the eye and it appears to be on the side of the face as well, i roated it 90 degrees in paint.
The pic was converted using adobe audition and some other program I can't remember. I couldn't get the links to work to hear it.
sorry if I sound stupid LOL but WHAT AUDIO ARE WE TALKING ABOUT???!!!
lena
Because no-one had figured out what the picture that was at hole2.thehansofoundation.org was for, somebody (can't remember who) decided to feed the file through an audio program pretty much just for the hell of it (tried everything else). When played back it sounded like save me but was really hard to tell. The guy who did it put a number of other images through to see what he could find and couldn't find anything so it was semi-reasonable to assume that maybe, just maybe it did say save me. Most thought wishful thinking but this latest clue seems to have strengthened the theory.
I leave the typing of passwords into the hanso site to other people because if something were to happen unexpectedly after entering a new password I would have a heart attack on the spot.
lol
nashgirl
Where did these images and folders come from? I thought I was pretty much up to date but don't remember any of that. Have I missed something?
Perhaps it is Bill Flood and Sam Hicks...good catch Kuckest! I think this new image looks alot like 'Henry Gale' of the Others...but I am reaching. The first faceless man image I still think it says 'I'm in NY'...reaching again? Perhaps one of these two men is still alive and being held captive...on an island????
Peace & Namaste
Has anyone noticed that the clues in the projects section have something to do with the actual project...the electromagnetic clue used a compass which uses the poles...this clue is on the mathmatical forcasting...it has to be solved mathmatically I beleive...they all have something to do with where the clue comes from...Math wizards have at it, not my best attribute!!
Peace & Namaste
"Has anyone noticed that the clues in the projects section have something to do with the actual project"
Nice observations on this thrasher76. Seems feasible.
Is this site in-game http://www.fastboot.com/hanso/Image/
It is many of the images and flash stuff seen on the Hanso site. How was the site above found or is this just somewhere that someone who has deconstructed the flash has put them?
The hidden picture, found here has the numbers 2630 on the bottom of it. I haven't seen this picture before. Do the numbers appear significant?
I think we need to assume that the key to the gif file codes is Q9 and T9. I don't know what to do about the chinese version, but surely there's someone familiar enough with text messaging to sort out what various messages can be spelled out using agen75 in T9 lingo (sadly, I am chronologically incapable of thinking this way). Isn't "75" translateable as "is okay"? That seems promising. The first word could be "Chen", but I don't know anyone in game with that name. Text messagers, help!
It was apparently a hidden image in the swf file used when you enter the mittelwerk clue (heir apparent I think). I got it while browsing through the folders found here under mettelwerk. This link was posted above by nashgirl.
Thanks for that holifyre
Kyle just emailed again. He reposted the audio to a server with more bandwidth if you're still trying to listen to the Hole2 picture converted to audio. The link is in Clue #45 and I'm going to try to put it in this comment.
He said he used a program called the Voice 3D Engine.
NEW LINK
Wizardry...isn't the shadow behind the numbers 2630 the same as the hole3 pic?
It worked fine. I just copy and pasted the files to a folder.
It seems to not really say 'anything but has the inflections of save me.
Sounds really creepy.
What does "gematrain" mean?
I don't think so loden. I can only see the possible image of Marvin Candle's labcoat but I doubt it. There does seem to be something behind the flash. Possibly a person on the right and a chair or stool on the left.
NB:
I'll bite. It seems like there might be something to Namibia, since (1) it is spelled wrong on the map, and (2) it is apparently shown in the small hidden image that someone (sorry, I forget who) found in the Indian Ocean. Maybe it's significant that in the small hidden map the Tropic of Capricorn is visible -- which "connects" Namibia to Brazil. Iran could be the third apex of a triangle, but I see no other connection. (And that's unlikely as a clue, since the triangle would cover a huge part of the globe.
Interesting: The "small map" of Namibia ("Nambia") shows part of Zambia, which is a suspicious hanso location. Also, there's an "I" missing from Namibia ("missing organs", Candle's glass eye, .)
Well I'm off to bed. As usual all the good stuff seems to be happening late at night for me.
But something I forgot to mention before that confused me is that if you view the source on the persephone.thehansofoundation.org it only has + and not +1. Anyone know why?
And I notice there is still no image at hole3. VERY fishy. Especially as the one who calls himself speaker assured that it was just due to server busy.
Night
Damn. I will never get to bed.
It seems to me that speaker is referring to the v-message system. Maybe it is all to do with the picture file names. Any thoughts?
...and people thought that I was crazy to look at the sound of the picture! Just a shame I couldn't quite make it out. Thinking back "Pale Sea" isn't to far from "Save Me" soundwise. Ah well.
Yeah, that is why I didn't follow it up (and I didn't post the sounds, because, well I'm too lazy to sign up anywhere I can upload it). I remembered seeing a program on the Judas Priest trial where the defence got the jury to hear "I asked her to get me a peppermint, and so she gave me one" backtracking on one of their records. I've also listended to a few questionable EVPs in which you can hear virtually anything if you are listening for it. Really if it is a genuine clue it's a bad choice of delivery. But the way it ties into everything else does make me think it is genuine. Just they used a "code" that was never going to give a definite answer. At least I feel less mad for trying it anyway.
Anyway, I am wondering now if Alvar and Magnus Hanso are indeed the same person and if they are the one that needs to be saved and is Persephone. Which makes me wonder if the "she" that used to work for the Foundation is a she from the show. Either that or Alvar is a woman and the "used" to bit is because she was overthrown. I think the maddness is back.
Alvar is, I'm fairly sure a name for light-elf. Good spirits from Norse/Germanic mythology (which makes sense if he is Scandinavian).
Technically it's Alfar but Alvar may be another version or it may be where the name came from or something. We haven't had any norse mythos yet and it's entirely possible with the Scandinavia link (and I'm better with Norse then Greece myths anyway).
Anyway, I've got to head off so will see where we are all at in the morning.
p.s. I like the Knight theory too.
Has anyone been on google talk to see the Speaker's message?
I saw a copy of the hole2 image in polar coordinates which looked like it could have been something. Could it be that we need to convert the home2 image and then perform a trick similar to the hole3 image on it???
Back to the math stuff
Brazil 8400*9.9*50.2=4174632 tan=3.077683537
Is there a location on the map where you would have
XXXXXX 8300*X.X*Y.Y = ZZZZZZZ tan=3.077683537
Perhaps the comment from The Speaker is related to the relation between Alvar and Magnus (whoever this is)/
perhaps "A son nor some medieval Joe" is another anagram.
You can definitely get "Alvar" and "seen" out of it, but nothing consequential.
I'm still working on it.
I tried the map coordinate thing and didn't notice anything other than the music on the Hanso site becoming MORE annoying.
LOL. A son nor some medieval Joe = Alvar denies someone mojo
Maybe, but I don't see "Joop" in his hair, so it can't be the same guy.
another anagram:
"SAVE ME Someone Join Lord A"
sorry, these anagrams take so much time...
tan 108 = -3.077683537
Streeettttccchhhhh!
If you convert t9agen75 to all letters (using A=1, etc.) you get
tiagenge
gait gene?
age tinge?
And my personal favorite:
giant EEG?
(An electroencephalogram [EEG] is a test to detect abnormalities in the electrical activity of the brain.)
Just having some fun.
This may be a bit off topic, but has anyone gotten into
http://webmail.thehansofoundation.org/ ???
Is this site related to the game or is it for development purposes??
tiagenge = Engage it ??
I merged the pictures very simpily but don't think its going to help much.
http://img93.imageshack.us/img93/2100/mergedholepics9ss.jpg
Theory
Marvin Candle expresses a sense of emotion when mentioning the incident in the Swan Orientation Video. I saw this more as a sense of guilt rather than "hey, I lost my arm." Marvin Candle, or whatever his real name is, believes his actions or inactions led to the death of someone significant. I believe that person was Alvar Hanso.
The Magnus Hanso gravesite on the door in the hatch references Alvar Hanso with the title of Magnus - a great man.
to be continued
Theory (cont'd)
Alvar Hanso was first and foremost a manufacturer of weapons, especially high-tech weaponry. His attempts to better humanity can easily be explained as self preservation.
He had already initiated the life extension program on himself based on the age of Joop. Remember, Hanso was selling arms during WWII, so he isn't some young guy, and the age of Joop means that the life extension program began much earlier than what we think it may be. Joop may just be the first successful experiment. How many failures did they have before that?
The eradication of disease, including mental illness, would be something of significant interest to a man that may live to be 2-3 times longer than the average person.
Cloning is the next logical step in the process. Even the life extension program doesn't guarantee a person immortality. This can explain Hanso's interest in genetics and experimentation with animals in apparently hostile environments. If it is possible to create a Polar Bear that can tolerate tropical temperatures, then could the logic be reversed and allow man to live in hostile environments as well?
Theory (cont'd)
With Alvar Hanso dead, well momentarily, a power vacuum was created among his followers and partners like the Widmores. Those loyal to Hanso, would proceed with a plan to clone their dead leader, a man by now they would view as being almost god-like. Other factions would attempt to take over, causing a rift in a once cooperative relationship. This might explain why we get a sense that there are more than one group of Others, and why one group refers to themselves as being the "good" ones.
Persephone has provided clues to the corruption within the Hanso Foundation. This SAVE ME clue is quite interesting. I think she is referring to Alvar Hanso - or more precisely his clone. If the incident happened recently, which I believe it has, then the clone of Alvar Hanso would be very young. It's quite possible the clone could be a baby.
Here's another point. I believe the Missing Organs are the Losties. The primary Missing Organ is Claire's baby - the Alvar Hanso clone.
When the others take the children, they do so because they are seeking Alvar's clone. The "Bad" Others seek him to prevent his eventual return, while the "Good" others seek him to restore Alvar - perhaps even accelerate his age and restore his memories.
So, why let Claire return to the Losties? I think the "Good" Others are more concerned with the "Bad" Others than they are with the Losties - who in their minds might just be Organ Donors for their members. Ethan did return to bring Claire back to the Others, and then Charlie killed him. If the "Good" Others showed special attention towards Claire's baby, who they beleive is the Alvar clone, then the "Bad" Others might figure it out and focus their attention there.
Yes, all of this is speculation based on the clues so far. Just trying to piece together a coherent message from the clues thus far.
Wow, KC! You set me back in my chair with that one. =o) Nice. I think you're probably quite close on some of your points.
Walt is interesting to them, but he's not really who they're after. Remember what Miss Cluh (sp?) said to Michael about Walt. Can't get into specifics without spoiling things for the folks who haven't yet seen the entire second season.
Perhaps there is another explanation for Alex. Did Alvar Hanso have a wife or possibly a daughter that he would have wanted to clone? Who funded Rouseau's research team? I know this may be a reach, but this is Lost.
RE: "A son nor some medieval Joe,"
I learned that, in Danish, the word for Joe is Joop. Maybe Alvar IS the son of Magnus, and has been transgenetically mutated into Joop!
I know...a wild theory! Still, I've felt all along that Joop is a former human, but who?
Also, we need to remember that the game is to fill in the back story, and may not explain everything on the show. I personally think the attention to the Hanso Foundation is taking us away from the current story being played out on the Island. I believe there's a DeGroot/Hanso faction of the Others, and another faction consisting of a Widmore/Hanso group. The question is, which group of Others really are the "good guys" and which ones are the "bad guys."
Here's another thing to think about. What if Ana-Lucia was right about the man she put in the hole? What if it came down to one Other killing another Other? I believe this was the only instance where a member of the Others killed someone. The rest of the deaths on the island have been caused by the survivors of the plane.
Matt and NB:
If your theory is that these numbres are significant as map coordinates, then I think you need to figure out where 0 longitude (or the center of the G-circle) belongs -- there's no reason to assume a Greenwich-based grid. Perhaps the blue dot on the map, or the circle that hid the link, or perhaps a location that we are being led to? I don't know, but if you were to line up your angles with a G-circle overlay, where's the center?
Sarah and JD
Also i believe that Boone wore a shirt that had the Chinese characters for 84 which i read somewhere represents good and evil or yin yang.
nb and matt:
What happens if you overlay another circle at Brazil -- what's at the center of the Iran, Brazil, Nambia "triangle"?
Matt:
I'm not convinced that Algeria is the answer. I think if you make the triangle line up, the center is somewhere more like Central African Republic. I know that doesn't help. And it also seems like you wouldn't need all the math clues to get there -- you could just draw a triangle from the icons in Iran, Brazil, and Namibia. (But those circles look really cool)
I suppose this could be pointing us back to the Zambi/Uganda (Makerere) thing, or maybe it's just nothing.
Matt:
If your looking for more math puzzles, consider whether the MFI logo has anything to offer. I have been wondering whether the "M root of fi" equation might come into play as a password/clue, especially after the "fi" disappeared in some of the logo treatments when the clues on the MFI page opened up. (I also noticed there's some reference to mystical roots in the whole Gematrian/Munck website, but it's all too esoteric for me. Maybe you'll do better)
I have to admit, I really do think this math quest is irrelevant. But who knows, you might stumble on the Valenzetti Equation or something.
Keep up the excellent work. I'm out.
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
Relocated from "The Next Level" comments:
oo7surge said...
A know this is a little late in coming, but I can't shake the feeling that we aren't getting everything out of some of our clues and I wanted to post my thoughts on the "faceless" pictures:
I believe the "save me" message was not about a person, but about the image itself. Consider that the image was replaced with the D2o version relatively quickly. Also, I've noticed some subtle differences in the 2 while I've been working with them:
1. the color pallettes are different - if you convert them both to windows pallette, the first has a dominantly blue background and the second has a reddish purple background.
2. the face in the first picture is wider than the second, even though the canvas is the same size.
I think we have more to do with these pics, and am still working with them. I keep thinking I'm finding numbers and letters in the grid, but haven't pinned down what they are yet. I'll post when I have found something.
6/03/2006 03:09:25 PM
Relocated from "The Next Level" comments:
oo7surge said...
Thanks to everyone for input on my back-tracking with the faceless pics.
ihearttoast: tried the 3d route, but couldn't turn it into anything... good idea though.
For the rest:
Here's all I've found so far:
There were two images of the first Faceless Man (here-after referred to as F1)
There were two images of the second Faceless Man (here-after referred to as F2)
F1: the two images have different color pallets. The first image had 4 shades on its pallet, while the second (and picture currently on hole2) only has two.
When I altered the the two "extra" colors, I found a band across the top of the photo that looks like it could be Morse Code (I have a cap of the photo before the change, and one after to show that these are not the same marks that were previously visible)
For F2, I have found that the color pallets have the same amount of colors, but they are not in the same order. This means that when you convert them to a standard pallet, such as the Windows System pallet like I have done, the images become different.
I'm not sure what the reason is for this yet, but I assume there is something to it. I can't fathom why they would have taken the time to change the pallets for these pictures if there wasn't something else there.
Sorry it took so long to get back on this, but I set up my own blog space to start posting pics and theories - and possibly some other nonsensical ramblings - on. You can see some pics there - http://lostsurge.blogspot.com/
6/03/2006 11:16:41 PM
nightmare: I did some more clean up and added it on the pics in my blog. Right now, I have this:
NEETEUTIJSDNTEEMET8ME7NK
Also not sure that it's right... could be reversed(?)... still working on it, but THANK YOU so much for the help.
Sarah.
Those pictures from the map are interesting. I thought I had seen something like what they were showing before. See here. Although there are similarities it doesn't look the same. This image came from the site talking about the gematrian circle. Maybe some other image exists which more closely matches the ones you see. I do think that it means something imho. I wonder if it has anything to do with the work being done by some of you guys placing the 3 gematrian circles on the map that interlink in Algeria. Keep up the good work.
: )
I REALLY need a copy of page 75 on MathQuest 5!!!!
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